French website logic-sunrise who is usually pretty clued up on these things indicates that Microsoft's new 199 Euro's Xbox 360 packs with 2 games and 2 wireless controllers are in fact OLD machines. After opening 10 of them, they found that the machines have been converted to new and all have non-falcon motherboards, old Hitachi 47 or Samsung MS25 drives and the repair center sticker on them. They suggest that you do not buy these packs and if you want a brand new machine, then fork out 199 Euro's for the arcade pack or 269 Euro's for the Premium pack